Home-built in California

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patavenier
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:53 am

Home-built in California

Postby patavenier » Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:26 pm

Hello from Northern California.
The need to build has struck here too. I have been enthralled by the design since seeing a line drawing in the book "Bicycling Science" over 25 years ago.
While I have built quite a number of fillet brazed (conventional) singles and tandems, this one remained on my must-do list. But how to go about it?
I started by scaling pics from the web, and then was very kindly provided some key dimensions by Dave Ductor (the US importer). The original plan was to weave a seat, but Dave also offered to sell me a couple of the leather seats used on the modern bikes so I could get out and ride sooner.
Tubes are 16mm chromoly from an aircraft supply house. Some small bits are from framebuilding suppliers but most are shop made in my garage.
Developing the fixtures was a significant task, as virtually no conventional ones were of any use. My favorite sort of challenge, however.
Gaz is quite right -building this bike can indeed take over all your thought processes till it's done. Then you need to build another because you learn much could have been done differently, and you have this really nice fixture... (which is unusable for anything else).
So number 2 (for my wife) will be getting painted later this week. Mine will likely stay "patina" with just a clear coat to keep it from rusting.
Apologies for the cell phone pic, but those towers appeared on my shake-down ride and I just couldn't resist.

pedersen-towers.jpg
pedersen-towers.jpg (122.86 KiB) Viewed 20436 times

simsha55
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:12 pm

Re: Home-built in California

Postby simsha55 » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:54 am

Re: self build advice

Sent: Wed Apr 16, 2014 6:37 pm
by simsha55
Paul
thanks for your reply I'll look forward to your return with keen anticipation, i had noticed the steering angle seemed slack, like you I have tried to scale off pictures on the net but a lot of images seemed stretched in the horizontal plane and I am working out how to correctly resize them to make the wheels circular.I'll put this post under ypur original post to move it to the public forum.
Regards Simon

self build advice

Sent: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:03 pm
by simsha55
Hi I saw on the Dursley Pedersen forum that you built your own bike, it looks fantastic! I also am starting to undertake this task and wonder if you could give me any hints, for example for larger frame sizes does the wheelbase increase so that you don't end up sitting too far back? I am 6 4" and I know pedersens are made to fit people larger than me but I've never sen a large example to have a look at. I have some old 1/2 inch renolds tube liberated from my dads garage I am going to use.
Thanks for any help, regards Simon

patavenier
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:53 am

Re: Home-built in California

Postby patavenier » Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:23 pm

As requested, here are the major dimensions of the "Royal Large" frame size as currently produced.
Wheelbase -1173mm. Head tube angle -65.2 deg. Fork offset/rake -104mm. Chainstay length -504mm. Seat tube(s) -750mm. Seat tube angle -59 deg. CL of seat tube to CL of head tube is 630mm. Fork length -915mm (bottom of crown race) and the CL of the lower fork bearing is 523mm below this point. The top of the steerer tube measures 1224mm above the ground.
That should get you started, the rest of the tubes can be cut to fit as desired once these points have been located on your fixture or workbench. I chose to braze all of the tubes together at the head tube intersection as I like the look (and challenge). The method of bolting them together with an "ear" welded to the head tube looks a bit out of place to me, but is a trick well worth considering as it will save hours of time. An additional benefit of that method is that reaming/facing of the head tube itself is simple. Reaming the bottom of the HT as I did it was quite frustrating as there is no room to use the (Campagnolo) HT reamer since the down tube(s) interfere.
I am 1.9m tall (6'3") and this frame size fits me well. There is room to adjust the seat a bit higher, perhaps another 40mm, but if I did then ideally the top of the head tube should be higher too, as the slope of the seat strap would flatten out a bit more than I find comfortable.
Good luck, and please ask any more questions you like.

simsha55
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:12 pm

Re: Home-built in California

Postby simsha55 » Tue Apr 22, 2014 10:12 pm

Paul
many thanks for the reply and info!! I have been practicing brazing readying myself for the challenge (it has been a few years since I brazed up a bike) I have to make my mind up yet how to put together the head tube and I am still looking at other Pedersens to come to a decision. Your dimensions will give me a start and I am getting to grips with drawing something up, I'll probably make the top of the head tube a bit higher as the idea of sliding forward doesn't appeal.
Did you braze straight onto a plane bottom bracket? or as I have seen fabricate some sort of lugs?
Anyway I'm off to start the drawings, again many thanks and I'll be in touch with many questions no doubt.
Regards Simon

patavenier
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:53 am

Re: Home-built in California

Postby patavenier » Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:30 pm

Hello Simon.
I have sent our site admin some pics which should answer some of your questions.
On the BB, I just made my own from a section of 4130 tube as I needed one quickly.
Good technique with the torch results in a very strong joint, the spigots just add weight (and you will never find a cast one with the configuration required to build one of these bikes).
They are available this way commercially as "lugless" and are relatively inexpensive from a framebuilding supply establishment.
Cheers -p

Pedersen
Site Admin
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:40 am
Location: Cordoba Spain (ex Cheltenham)

Re: Home-built in California

Postby Pedersen » Sat May 03, 2014 11:07 pm

Thanks Paul Tavenier for your superb, detailed, photos of your recent build of a new Pedersen. They deserve a special page somewhere on this site... and will get it soon!

In the meantime here are the photos in a small contact sheet version:
paul-tavenier-build.jpg
paul-tavenier-build.jpg (120.5 KiB) Viewed 18485 times

uncletam
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun May 25, 2014 6:31 am

Re: Home-built in California

Postby uncletam » Sat Jun 14, 2014 7:52 am

Hi there Im very impressed by the cool finish on the frame! Im thinking of biulding one and would like to ask what is the size of the tubing used? also where would that be sourced from in the uk? many thanks.

patavenier
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:53 am

Re: Home-built in California

Postby patavenier » Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:36 pm

Hello all.
Tubing used on the bike above is all 16mm (5/8") 4130 with the exception of the rear tubes on the fork which is 12.5mm (1/2") and the chainstays which are Columbus.
I needed every mm of the raw chainstays to get the length needed. All tubes are of ,9mm (.035") wall thickness, which is heavier than needed in my opinion if good brazing technique is used. I chose it because it was inexpensive and readily available from Aircraft Spruce here in the US. There must be a similar source in the UK but I have no idea who/what it would be. The 5/8" stock is marked "Bentler made in Germany".
There is no formal finish, it was left "as brazed" with just some basic file-and-emery cloth clean up. I gave it a rather cursory coat of clear laquer from a rattle can, poorly applied because the bike was already half assembled. It is now showing a bit of light surface rust in places which I will address soon.


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